Gardening - freq of feeding?

We in the past have used liquid fertilizers as well as complete fertilizers that comes in a pellet form as well as blood and bone and sheep pellets. I read online that they only need to be feed twice per the growing season. Is that all is required, what happens if the plant is lacking growth? Some people get into a habit of always feeding their plants so frequently not sure if it is if they have time and they are doing a bit of gardening they always feed it thinking the more they feed, the more it grows.

1) Would it be other factors like weather factor, and for things like rosemary could be the hole was dug not dep enough? 2) Those that grow in containers we have spring onions. Do they need to be taken out every year and the soil to be replenished with new compost etc? 3) You cannot use the same soil in the container year after year and just add fertilizer or can you?

Much thanks.

I add third year spent mix to my compost heap in layers, so it gets recycled when I use the finished compost. First year mix I add slow release mid season when plants are in full growth, then again when I replant the following crop. I find the biggest deficit with potting mixes as they age is their tendency to lose bulk, which makes them quicker to dry out and become hydrophobic. Thats when they go into the bins to become more organically balanced with fibres and leaf molds in the composting process. Then I reuse it as the base for new container fills and as a mulch.

Overuse of fertilizers can be considered as bad as under use, frankly. It all comes down to an understanding of soils, conditions and the requirements of what you are growing. I could spend weeks trying to guide you through differing scenarios, and you and others on here would yawn and go "too hard" and "boring" ! Every gardener has failures, in one form or another, but I don't know how many times over the years that I have said this, but get yourself a really good and comprehensive book (NOT Google) then you always have at hand the advice and solutions (hopefully) you seek. In time, it will become second nature to you and you will be able to pretty much work out what growing problems are attributable to. Christmas is coming and a good book will make a handy present but if that is not possible - there is always the library. There is so much drivel on Google that you need to already know the answers to sort out the good stuff from the rubbish and that is not at all helpful. If you are a vegetable gardener as opposed to a flower gardener - try and find the appropriate kind of book. Know what kind of soils you have and what nutrients or trace elements it needs in order to have a balanced soil in which to grow - and also know what the soil requirements are of the things you want to grow. What is known as "soil less mediums" ie potting mixes, composts etc are not the ideals to grow in as they rely on chemical fertilizers which deplete reasonably quickly for growth. You really are better off to concentrate on improving your soils and their structures and growing in ground where possible. I am sure there are plenty on here that could point you in the direction of really good, proven books that they rely upon for sound advice in your chosen field.

Research is an enormously powerful tool for us all in any endeavour, and we are blessed to have access to the internet, libraries, and other experienced gardeners. The trick I think, is as piquant points out, to make good use of all those resources to build our own knowledge so we can apply it to the different growing scenarios we all use.

There is such a thing as overdoing it which can cause plant health issues. Twice is fine.
I would redo pots. use home made compost, they'll grow like weeds. If you absolutely have to use bought stuff, then feed twice a year.

We are not in a position to compost our own. Is it ok to buy compost from the stores? I am thinking of the lines of adding compost and mix it into the current soil and then maybe add feed sparingly 2x a year.

The ones in the container. We have mainly used the bought from the store "potting mix".

Oh what about the City Council landfill compost which they sell, are they better?

So what is your situation? You say you are not in a position to make your own compost. Are you in a flat or similar and have no ground of your own and therefore are reliant upon pots? Compost is not really a growing medium - it is a soil conditioner. Sure, it does have some nutritional value, a small amount of nitrogen mostly but most of the store bought product is from forestry by product or greenwaste. The problems associated with greenwaste operations from local councils is that they have NO CONTROL over what is put into the greenwaste and subsequently composted. Sure, they can put up signs till the cows come home not to put this or that into greenwaste, but human nature is such that most don't give a toss about what they secrete in their loads and as a result you get highly undesirable problems such as oxalis and ivy (which isn't resolved by the heat in composting) or worse still, the effects of residual chemicals which can have disasterous effects on your growing efforts. Not worth the risk. So what are you trying to grow? Are you trying to supplement your food supply or growing ornamentals such as flowers? If it is the former and you have no ground - is it a possibility to rent an allotment or maybe share with a neighbour or friend? Without seeming to pry - it is not easy to help when you don't really have the facts.

Ok . I was hoping the council compost would be better since they collect green waste from people. I heard people some purchase mushroom composts from farms but not sure if these are available in the Wellington region.

We have a normal house with a backyard in Wellington. We are wanting to grow herbs and vegetables mainly ie spring onions, rocket, lettuce, cucumber, pumpkins, spinach, oregao, basil; we do have a few rose trees from the previous owner.

We have tried using a Bunnings Compost bin in the past but people found it difficult to work with. When we dismantled it down, there were still fruits that had not decomposed fully. It was also challenging to mix it.

We had this:
https://www.bunnings.co.nz/compost-bin-240ltr_p0193494

Yes we thinking of using compost and mix it thru with the existing soil and then grow herbs and veges and transfer the established seedlings.

In our place. We are in the newer areas of Wellington. The situation is that the backyard is quite hard and dry and it is down sloping. Quite granite type of ground. The previous owner had mainly shrubs which we have cleared out over the years. So along the staircase on the side a few garden beds which we have added garden mix or top soil with compost mixture. We do have containers and they are mostly herbs and spring onions because we don't have that much area to grow since the ground is so hard and it is down sloping. Along the flatter bits around the laundry line it is grass lawn and we built a small section for a raised garden. In went top soil and compost and we grow stuff there.

We have tried to grow citrus trees here. We dig a deep hole and in went garden mix and organic feed and then the tree with water sitting in the hole before that for a few days. All of them had to be transplanted to the front of the house. A number of them died. The easiest to grow at the back appears to be rosemary and lavender and peach trees.

Re: a compost If we revisit it, maybe using 1 or 2 open piles at the top of the backyard could be a way to compost? I had looked online and they do have some compost containers that you can spin by the handle but they are a bit on the costly side.

Well, that is most helpful. Being one of the newer areas of Wellington indicates to me that where housing development has taken place, it's likely that a lot of the topsoil will have been removed - seems to be what they do these days. Not helpful to gardeners though. It sounds as if the sub soil is clay. Hence the lack of drainage and why your fruit trees have largely gone west. I would think that your best bet would be to advocate raised garden beds. The trouble with pots is that they are generally too small and the outsides heat up too much and cook the contents. Raised beds are usually substantially larger and whilst they also dry out quicker than planting directly inground, they are easier to keep in a condition suitable for successful growing. Most of the things you mention growing are relatively shallow rooting so you won't need an excessively deep planter. Mushroom compost is good but it does contain a large amount of lime which may not suit all of your crops. It also has a tendency to diminish by about half over a season. You could spread copious quantities of gypsum over the subsoil before establishing your boxes and that will, over time, assist greatly in breaking down the clay to afford better drainage. I personally, wouldn't use those plastic composting bins - my limited experience of them is that they encourage flies and often the wrong stuff is placed in them. Composting properly is an art and a balance of nitrogenous and carbon materials, layered so that worms and bacteria can start the process of breaking down the materials. Never put too much, or too thick a layer of any one component as this makes the process harder to work. Here is a link to a good explanatory video on compost making and the do's and don'ts that accompany it. A two bin side by side with open front concept is great as it allows access to turn the compost or to turn it into the second bin as it breaks down, allowing you to start the process in bin 1 again.
https://www.bhg.com/gardening/yard/compost/how-to-compost/
You could also use the gypsum with a heavy layer of mulch in places where you would like to plant trees in the future. It will take a number of years to sufficiently break that subsoil down in order to be able to provide the right drainage but you will be heading in the right direction. But with your raised beds, use only top quality topsoil (screened) and supplement with compost, mushroom compost (if applicable) humus etc. Your use of sheep pellets and blood and bone (both nitrogenous) should be kept in balance with other nutrients. Otherwise you will find a large amount of leafy growth without much substance and little fruiting. One book I could absolutely recommend and will give you so much information it isn't funny is Andrew Steens Grow it yourself Vegetables. For NZ by a NZer. All the very best, growing in challenging circumstances can test your mettle but to achieve good results will give you all the encouragement you need! Doing all this on a tight budget is what the majority of us have to do - you don't need fancy pre-made bins - what is most important is understand why your previous trees and plants did not survive or do well - no-one can afford to keep replacing these things in the hope that the next will do fine. That's just throwing money away.

Spot On.

Yes, the ground is granite and hard. On the side of the property at the back we can see the side of the backyard, it's like a rocky hill. It is like a dry hiking track with yellow tan colour rocks sharp edges pointing out. Yes, when we dug our holes in the garden past a point you see a bit of top loose soil is it, then it becomes a darker tan brown colour with a dense floury texture maybe clay.

A few years ago when we built the raised gardens yep, we sprinkled gypsum added some cardboard, some organic feed like sheep pellets and blood and bone when a mixture of top soil and Bunnings compost. We are thinking to stir in some compost.

We can use some old timber and nail 2 compost bins side by side with a open section. No roof top required right?

We will have another go at our black plastic compost bin. I watched a video and we will deposit the greens and browns into a few buckets and then each fortnight we pour it into the compost bin at a 1:2 ratio. Doing by the cold compost method doesn't require mixing or we can mix it. We haven' seen any compost bins with the open side, there are those made of wood which you can take the one side off and there are more $$ compost bins which you can rotate the handle to mix it. In the past we didn't manage the ratio at all, it was just food left overs and scraps and lawn cuttings and in it went treating it as a garbage bin.

We sure can sprinkle generous gypsum everywhere and cover up with mulch.

Thanks for the book recommendation, will check out the library for it. :)

Question - we've been using a mixture of compost and garden mix and premium mix over the years from Bunnings and Palmers. Not the area of raised garden but around the yard we made some quick garden beds about 15-20cm high to grow things like lettuce and herbs. The soil is quite sandy. Any remedy of this? I thought about adding compost to enrich it?

Thanks for all the help!

Another thing you could do is have a wander down your street or around your subdivision/area and see who has a reasonable looking garden and go knock on their door and ask them about their regime. They will be growing stuff in the same soil type as what you are, so maybe able to provide some tips and tricks about what they have done and what does and doesnt grow well. Ive found in the past, that most people with nice gardens are usually approachable. You have nothing to lose.

https://trademe.tmcdn.co.nz/photoserver/full/1438890508.jpg
This is the sort of thing I'm suggesting - it has slats in the front that can be removed for ease of mixing or transferring to the other bin or wheelbarrow etc. Whatever you do - DO NOT put in cooked stuff, meat, bones, dairy etc as it will attract vermin and contaminate the aerobic cycle. Compost heaps are not dustbins. Dispose of other food waste to landfill. It does not need a lid on it - a piece of old carpet will work just as well. It just doesn't need to get sopping wet but does need moisture. You have to obviously pay more attention to the mix of carbon and nitrogen - for example - if you put loads of grass clippings in in one hit - it will go either to slime (anaerobic) or will heat up and go mouldy. Both will have a bad effect and will stink. Watch the video - it's pretty self explanatory. nzmax's suggestion of recruiting neighbourhood assistance is very good - gardeners are a pretty generous lot usually and will willingly pass on good information. If you break down your composting materials - ie fallen leaves and small twigs by running the lawn mower over them, then that will help to speed up the process somewhat. Some horticultural suppliers that have bulk composts etc also have things they call garden mixes which is probably a combination of compost, composted sawdust, blood and bone and sand with possibly a few other additions including soil which may be a useful base for you to use. 15-20cms is really a bit minimal for growing even shallow rooting crops. I would make them deeper if I was you . Re sandy soils - leaf mould is good. Go out and pick up bags of dropped leaves and either put them in bins (like the compost ones) or at worst, leave them in sacks and put them in a sheltered, shady space for the winter. They will break down well over winter and add humus to the soil. If you have a park nearby, ask the council if you can collect the dropped leaves.

Thanks again :)

We will now work on the compost and aging the leaves up and increasing the height of the garden beds.

Attached are a few images to give you a better idea of the situation. So we are using a raised garden (not shown) and more shallower garden beds and also containers. Also included is a photo of the side of the backyard to give you an idea of the granite type ground we have.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/rnais58ndynpifc/AABTBAyAA0pOXgVPaSI2ksn6a?dl=0 Overtime time after unsuccessful attempts we started doing some in containers. If townhouses and apartments can grow off pots maybe that was an option.
Through marketing, we do get told about various shallow garden beds like this right .

https://www.gubba.co.nz/raised-garden-beds/get-growing-notched-kitset-garden-bed-1350x1000x270/?gclid=CjwKCAiA7939BRBMEi
wA-hX5J-TFnPBogL9OYjIDBf7R3jVnka4iOrj3RqrnIvAwQYjs2yIjn7OFLR
oCC0UQAvD_BwE

Yes, we know someone who lives nearby us, a even newer build. They built raised gardens and had to purchase top soil and prepare their garden that way .

My comiserations for what you have to start with. It's a hard road to hoe (no pun intended) to try and get results when everything seems against you . However, it is amazing what you can achieve if it becomes important enough to you. Now, another question. Are you handy and do you have any tools? It seems a bit needless to be spending out a hundred bucks on a small raised bed . There are plenty of other materials you can use if you have the wherewithall to go look for it, transport it etc. Broken concrete from someone replacing a driveway (sometimes landfill will let you take same - if you ask) I have no idea what sort of age group you are - maybe you are not able to do this - any local help available to assist? You can also make beds with corrugated iron or even pallet wood - but do be aware that it is not treated wood so will only last a few years. If it is a lot of work for you - try and use something more permanent. Well, I wish you all the best and hope you have the motivation to be able to achieve a good result. Do remember though that everyone has failures - don't let that put you off - just resolve to find out why and do it differently next time!

Yes, we have some hardware tools. We built our raising bed. We didn't buy it, the link was that many advertisements market pretty shallow garden beds so we thought it was safe to make one around 20cm high. I myself in my early 40s.

We have a bag of gypsum powder so can put that to use all over the backyard, haha.

May be you can see the soil it's sandy and dry. Would it be handy for now until we can mould leaves and get our compost going, for now to purchase some wetting agent and then we stir in some council landfill compost?

What I can say is that a few months ago my dad dug a hole at the wrong place for a citrus tree which we moved because it was struggling. So we used that hole for chives or spring onions. It's deeper than 20cm and it's growing better and quicker than the other ones. The soil isn't sandy either.

get a soil test .then find out what your plants need .then make a plan to change your soll to match what the plant needs

From what I can see, the main issue is that you either don't have a lot of topsoil - or if you do - it's in pretty poor condition. Improvement of soils is a long process. Depleted, soured, compacted soils require the addition of humus to retain moisture to assist in the improvement of the soil. This is why I said that compost and humus were soil conditioners as opposed to real sources of food. The object of the exercise is to produce a crumbly, free draining soil that does retain moisture. I know that sounds ambiguous but what you seem to have at present does not drain at all - if you dig a hole - the water just sits there - it's like digging a bucket! There is no real quick fix for this. Raising beds and bringing in topsoil is an option, but underneath, the problem remains. This is why the gypsum is so important - to break up that clay. You say you have a bag of gypsum - I would use a 25kg bag in a relatively small area if the problem was bad enough. Several times over, probably, in the course of a few years. Follow the instructions on the bag. I'd say you are not using enough for it to have much effect. This is why it is so important to understand the "science" of growing - how your soils work and how differing soils affect how and what you grow. Try and find an ace vege grower in your area and ask for tips - also join a garden group - although I'm sorry to say that those seem to be more about visiting gardens and afternoon teas these days than actual gardening.

OK, we have 6 of 8kg of Tui Clay Break Gypsum. When you say 25kg, do you mean all at one go or . we've only used a handful over the area etc .

As it is now you think we should get compost and improve the soil as it is now? Otherwise the garden would be quite bare.

I'll google in a soil test.

Remembered we have a McGregors 2 needle soil tester. Moisture is about the level 2 on a scale 1-10 so it's on the dry side. PH level is about 6.9 or nearly 7.0. We had some morning rain but it's now fine.

OK so your pH is pretty much neutral so that is good. Gypsum will not overly affect your pH levels even though it is a calcium, it is calcium sulfate, not calcium carbonate.
I'm not quite sure what you mean by adding compost now and the garden being quite bare. I think we might be talking at cross purposes, somehow. You are mostly concerned with the growing of vegetables - yes? That is what I have been concentrating on. A plot that you can get into such a condition that will allow you to achieve this. Depending upon what it is that you wish to grow (you have mentioned summer crops such as lettuce and cucumbers) there may be a time that you need to prepare your soils prior to sowing or planting. This probably would have been a better conversation to be having earlier on in the year, but then again, if you were trying to grow winter crops in your plot, the same issues would occur.
I think, probably, you need more local assistance. Someone who can visit and determine what the actual issues are. In situations like this (backwards and forwards on a forum) suggestions can only be made based upon the information supplied. You don't need to do a soil test at this stage, you have determined the pH is neutral (which is good). Maybe go to your local garden centre and see if there is anyone there that knows of anyone that can help you in your specific needs.

There is a garden store actually around the corner and literally 5min walk away. Might do that now!

I had a conversation with a friend who has a successful garden with citrus trees in our area today. He used a jack hammer (?) to dig a deep hole. He buys a trailer of garden mix from a landscaping company every year .

Yes, growing vegetables. We have a raised garden now, the height of the soil has dropped a bit (not in the photos) and the garden beds alongside the staircase. What kind of use can those be put towards for this season? It's loose sandy and dry. For the staircase beds and our raised garden to add compost or some mix soil? Or is it don't add any compost or mix and prep the area for next year? Everyone I have spoke to in our area have resorted to topping up with compost or mix to get it going "every year". Someone else who is an acceptable gardener had a good garden but when they moved over here but an adjacent suburb also struggled to garden .

I don't really know what else I can tell you as I don't seem to be getting the point over very well. these are the salient points:
When the existing soil is poor and lacking the ability to retain moisture, nutrient and grow suitable plants - add something that will assist in achieving that. Yes, Compost or garden mix or a mix of that and some good topsoil.
Any of these types of "manufactured" growing mediums are going to deplete rapidly and are going to need topping up on a regular basis, as is the fertilizer required to sustain growth.
The best solution is to try and improve the soil you have and the microbial activity as well as the presence of earthworms which will assist greatly in breaking down the soils resulting in a crumbly loam which best suits the purpose. This last thing is what is going to take the longest time to achieve but you should be striving to achieve this whilst possibly having to manage with the lesser alternatives in the process.